Tag Archives: treatment protocols


So as Matt said this time, we’re just doing the same thing, elevated ileum, but it’s its relationship to the shoulder girdle and then shoulder dysfunction and other upper extremity type problems. But we’ll give some more specific examples, but just keep in mind that there could be a whole ton of different, dysfunctions that could come from just one simple thing, like an elevated ilium.”

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Disclaimer: The following is an actual transcript. We do our best to make sure the transcript is as accurate as possible, however, it may contain spelling or grammatical errors.  Due to the unique language of acupuncture, there will be errors, so we suggest you watch the video while reading the transcript.

Hello, everyone and happy new year. Thank you very much for attending. My name is Matt Callison.  Hi, thanks for attending. I’m Brian Lau.  We’re from ACU sport education and the sports medicine acupuncture certification program. Thank you to the American Acupuncture Council for having us. We have a sports acupuncture webinar. It’s always really fun to be able to do this once a month or every other month. This particular one, we’ve got more information for you. We have such a good time last month with Ian Armstrong, who’s the teacher of the postural assessment and corrective exercise class in the smack program. Brian and myself had a great time discussing elevated ilium and his contribution to medial knee pain had explored the different sinew channels and different acupuncture points and exercises that can be used to help to correct this. Then Brian, I was thinking that’d be great to be able to actually do something similar, looking at an elevated ilium and its contribution to a superior shift of the scapula or an elevated ilium and the injuries that that can cause. And some exercises that would be useful to apply after the acupuncturist acupuncture treatment. So, unfortunately though, Ian had some cut amendments, he wouldn’t be able to join us. So Brian and I are going to go ahead and take this over. Um, Brian, what do you think about us going to the intro slide? And if you have any words or so you want to share,

Uh, no, no, basically I guess just the small thing is that, um, elevated ilium could cause a whole ton of kind of, uh, potential pain patterns of low back pain, hip pain, a whole bunch of them. Last time we chose to see how it can relate to the lower extremities, especially the knee for medial knee pain. So it’s just an example, example to see how to start prescribing exercises, how to add them into the full, comprehensive treatment. So as Matt said this time, we’re just doing the same thing, elevated ileum, but it’s its relationship to the shoulder girdle and then shoulder dysfunction and other upper extremity type problems. But we’ll give some more specific examples, but just keep in mind that there could be a whole ton of different, uh, dysfunctions that could come from just one simple thing, like an elevated ilium. Hmm.

All right. Well, let’s go to the next slide. I think that’s a good segue for you. Want to go ahead and start with this one?

Yeah. So, uh, with this image, uh, again, we’re, we’re focusing in on a postural disparity, uh, we picked an elevated ilium cause it’s clinically relevant. It’s very common. You see it a lot in, uh, in clinic and you see both how it can relate. Like I said to, to local pain patterns, like low back pain, et cetera, but, but how it really becomes, you know, since so much weight transfers through the hip, it’s really one of the key structures, uh, that determined cemetery for a lot of the rest of the body. So if you can balance the pelvis that goes a long way in and of itself to balance the shoulder girdle, to balance the lower extremity knee position, foot position, et cetera. Uh, so it’s not the only thing. Um, but it’s a really a big thing. So we’ll look at its relationship to the shoulder girdle today and give some exercises review, uh, refer back to last times podcast where we looked at some exercises for the ilium itself.

Um, and then we’ll look at some exercises for shoulder girdle, but then how to combine those with acupuncture treatments. So in this image, you see this gentleman on the right there’s a elevated and you can kind of see the schematic, um, image. You can see that he has an elevated ilium on the left. So he follow, uh, you know, the line from the top of each, uh, iliac crest. You can see an elevated ilium on the left. We’ll look at some other ways you can measure it in the second, uh, then look at just for now the relationship that calm. And this is the most common way that it would present is that you’d have a balancing, you know, in the girdle of the shoulders, the shoulder girdle balance, where it’s going to start to compensate to that elevated ilium. And in this case, you see that elevated scapula on the right. And that’s probably the most common way that this would present. It could do it differently, but this is definitely the most common opposite elevated scapula or a superior shift. You might call that

Just want to emphasize as well that Brian was talking about balancing the elevated ilium or any kind of, uh, ileum type of partial disparities. I mean, the reason why it’s, you can see that it’s going to be the middle section of the skeleton. That’s going to affect what’s happening above and below in addition to housing, the dantien and the kidneys just above. So by balancing that aspect that helps, helps all kinds of different things they acupuncturist can be treating from pelvic floor dysfunction, lower jaw disharmony, OB GYN, middle job disharmony. So looking at balancing at the muscle skeletal systems, not just for orthopedic, it’s also for helping those on food. So that’s, that’s great. And this is what we emphasize in, in the smack program is trying to be able to get that elevated ilium or any kind of partial disparities and pelvis to go ahead and treat that first, which I’m sure a lot of practitioners will actually go for that as well. Yeah. Brian, before we go to the next slide. Okay.

Yeah, the we’re going to be zeroing in, in a second more on the shoulder and scapular position, but in this particular model, you can also really see the change in the position of the neck. And I’ll just give you a very simple way to see it. If you could picture that ilium elevated. I think I mirror image near my right hands up, but I’m trying to make it look like my left hand to kind of match this, this model, if, uh, the aliens elevated on the left, the person’s not going to stand in such a way that they’re, they’re leaning, you know, the leaning tower of PISA over on that side. And everything’s pointing, you know, uh, to the left, they’re going to find some place to compensate that someplace could be multiple places. It could be in the spine, which you see a little bit of in this model.

It can be in the shoulder girdle, it can be in the neck, they’re going to find some way to get their eye and their head and, um, ear position, you know, the equilibrium of the body a little bit more balanced. So if the shoulder girls are really fixed, maybe they’re going to find a way to do that all in the neck. Um, but the common one, the, the very frequent thing you see at least, um, that’s going to be part of this dynamic is the, uh, contralateral shoulder being higher and the, you know, compared to the hip, so left hip right shoulder, right hip left.

Great. As you can see the image on the right, the patient has an elevated ilium on the left and looks like there is elevation on the right as well. He does have a little lateral tilt to the right with the scapula quite. I mean, with the head that Brian was just talking about. So one of the muscles that we’re going to actually the only muscle that we’re talking about, primary muscle that we’re going to be talking about as well, the levator scapula. So can you see where the levator scapula attaches on the image on the left, the superior medial border of the scapula close to small tests in 13, and then it’s other attachment is going to be the transfers process of C1, C2, C3, C4. So the superior shift of the scapula, and you’ve got a shortening of that. Levator scapula, small tests and CGU channel that we’re going to get into a little bit more in this webinar, in a lock short position, it’s pulling the neck to the lateral side. So multitude of injuries can be occurring from this that we’re going to be getting into. All right. All right. Well then let’s go to the next slide. The quick review. This is what we talked about last month about measuring the ileum. Um, so you can see the middle image. There’s the hands are coming in on the side, on the lateral side, and the fingers are placed at a level line, right on top of that alien, it gives you an idea of where side is going to be elevated.

Well, I’m a person that, that doesn’t work for the camera position. So, well,

Go ahead, Brian. You can finish.

No, I just wanted to say that just for people to know that the, if you’re measuring that you’d be right behind the person that mats moved to the side to be able to see whatever his hands are. So just that heads up.

Yeah. True. And then functional anatomy from, um, OHS, overhead squat from the national Academy of sports medicine. Looking also at what happens with an elevated Dalian was usually an asymmetrical hip shift. And there’s a whole slew of sinew channel imbalances that occurs with this. And once we see this kind of posture where we’re automatically thinking of different acupuncture points that we can treat for locally adjacent and distant of the primary channels and the Sr channels, in addition to what this kind of Bosch is going to be doing to the organ.

All right, well, let’s go to the next slide please.

All right. So here, you’ve got elevated scapula or also called a superior shift of the scapula, and it’s going to be associated with a lock short levator scapula that we discussed earlier, which you see here on this individual’s left side. This individual has an elevated ilium on the right often like Brian was saying it’s probably most of the times, but not all the time. There’s never an always is that the opposing side will have a superior shift of the scapula. Sometimes you’ll see a superior shift of the scapula on the same side of an elevated ilium, but what we’re going to be discussing here will still apply. All right? So this posture can lead to many different muscle and channel imbalances that we’re going to be discussing just a few of them. Um, some of the injuries that can happen with this will be rotator cuff tendinopathy, but Ron boy, minor constrain thoracic outlet syndrome. And there’s more Brian, do you want to say anything before we go to the next line?

Uh, well, I think we also have, uh, in the slide or is this the next one? Yeah, the downward downwardly rotated, uh, scapular position. And I think we have a little bit more on the next slide, so we can go over it a bit more there. Um, but uh, if you look at the scapula in this position, the left side, that I’ve looked at the glenoid cavity. So the, um, I have a little scapula here, so, uh, I think this look more like my, uh, left side of your looking through the rib cage at the front surface of the scapula, the glenoid fossa would go up. That would be upward rotation. This patient has more of a downward rotation of the scapula. And that’s pretty typical when the levator scapula shorten. We’ll talk about this again in the next slide, but, um, but that’ll play into some of the, um, discussions we have coming up in a few, few slides also. Okay. So next please.

All right, so this video’s not playing, maybe if you click on it, it’ll play.

I see. Okay.

So it’s not playing unfortunately. Well, that’s what happens with technology sometimes. So let’s just walk there.

I think it’s coming, isn’t it? Oh yeah. I can see them working on it. It looks good. There it goes.

Thank you. Okay. So one of the actions of the levator scapula as the name suggests it’s going to elevate the scapula. Now, what this is not showing is that you do have elevation in the scapular, but if you look at the origin, the assertion or the distal proximal attachments, it will also downwardly rotate that scaffold. If you will, Brian, can, you should have downward rotation again in your scapula.

Yeah. So tell me, Matt. And you can tell me if this is a case, this is the right scapula, but I think since we’re on, I think everything’s mirrored image. I’m trying to look at, make it look like the same. So does that look like the right side?

Yes. But can you do us a favor? Can you go ahead and keep it in front of you? Because it blends very well with the white background. Yeah. Okay. That looks really great, but you don’t have to raise it up a little bit, at least on mine now. Okay, good.

Yeah. So you’re seeing through my rib cage to the front surface of the scapula levator scapula would be attaching here to see one, two, three, and four transverse processes, a muscle of the small intestines in your channel, and it would lift or elevate the scapula. And at the same time it would soaps and please me or imaging, it’s hard. It would bring the side of the neck down to that side to its side, bend the head, but we’re talking mainly about the scapular position. So elevating the scapula. Okay.

That’s great. So let’s go to the next slide, please. I don’t think we’re going to talk a little bit more about the rotation. Okay.


Yeah. And this one we’ll look at the downward rotation of the scapula

That’s there’s upward rotation downward. So when you see green about levator scapula, that’s when it’s shortening concentric contraction, it’s active and the Red’s going to be a lengthening contraction. So green is going to be upward, rotate downward rotation, and then you’ve got your upward rotation. So in a locked short levator scapula, you can see how it have a propensity to be stuck in a downward rotation, which will then when you’re raising the arm to shoulder abduction, like the scapula humeral rhythm, that images that’s on the right there, the greater tubercle, a big prominence on the humerus or the super spine EDIS and infraspinatus. And on the opposite side, the bicipital long head tendon can come up and hit that at chromium and cause a tendinopathy and impingement. There’s one more image. I think that will also be able to help with this. Um, can we go to the next slide?

Yeah, there we go.

Yeah. So then this would be when the levator scapula has been placing that scaffold into a downward rotation, as the arm goes into abduction, then the propensity for that greater tubercle to hit that a chromium is much, much higher leading to injuries that we were talking about. So all of this gives us actually protocols to be able to treat this, but for right now levator scapula is going to be a big one to do. Um, and we will talk about exercises here in a second. Brian, do you want to add anything to this?

Yeah. So, uh, the main thing we’re looking at those is very, I guess, biomechanical, we’re looking at particular muscles in this case, the levator scapula and how it’s going to elevate the scapula and how it’s going to tend to hold the scapula into that downer rotation of it’s shortened. It’s going to prevent the scapula from being able to follow the arm position, right. That would be normal movement to help keep that space between the acromion and the head of the humerus, uh, open. So it doesn’t pinch structures like the supraspinatus tendon, the bicep, uh, biceps tendon. So you’d want the scapula to be able to come upward and upward rotation as you’re going into AB duction. But if it’s kind of held too firmly in place by an overtight levator scapula and maybe some other structures, then it’s going to prevent that scapula from moving and then the arms going to bump into the chromium and, uh, that can lead to a lot of different pain patterns of the shoulder.

So that’s a very biomechanical view. That’s great, that’s great information and of itself, but then we have to remember that we have this whole, you know, really beautiful, intricate channel system. And, uh, the levator scapula, the muscle we’re kind of looking at in this case is a muscle of the small intestines and new channel. So we can needle it at the motor point, but we might include small intestine channel points to help contribute to a more thorough therapeutic outcome. We started with the elevated ilium, uh, and the quadratus lumborum is a big muscle that’s involved with the elevated ilium as are the AAD doctors, the thigh and hip add doctors. Those are muscles of the liver sinew channel. So we have this midday, midnight channel relationship that’s involved with, uh, maybe this local problem. We have a very, um, more comprehensive channel perspective that we can look at and start including points to directly affect the elevated Lam like the quadratus lumborum like add Dr. Longest liver channel points, maybe something like liver five, um, in combination with small intestine channel points and more local needling at the small intestine channel sinews. And then we can add other points in our acupuncture treatment based on the specific injury and other things we’re finding and you know, this person, blood deficient or inefficient or something like that. So this is starting to paint a more of a comprehensive picture that we’re looking at.

That’s something we find a lot in our own clinical practices, looking at the midday and midnight relationship between the liver on the small tests and channel, especially when there’s a shoulder abduction problems, such as what we’re seeing this slide, um, elevated ilium and shoulder abduction problems, pretty darn common. You’ll see that a lot in the clinic. Um, if you would, when you’re looking at the scapula, you guys, I take a look at that superior medial border of the scapula. That’s where the levator scap is going to be attaching where many people have that five Brodick tension in there that many of us will go ahead and needle right through that, um, that levator scapula, as we talked about before, it’s going to be attaching to the C1 through C4, transverse processes, attached to that. Then it goes down and it travels to the superior medial border.

Like I said, it blends in seamlessly with the super spy Natus muscle that’s located in the supraspinous fossa in this particular image. If you go disorder, large tests and 16 would be, then you’ve got large and tests and 15, just on the other side of the chromium, hopefully you guys are following along with this large test at 15 is where the super spine Natus tendon is going to be attaching. It’s usually about a quarter of an inch to an AF, probably five, eight, five eights of an inch wide blending into the capsule and attaching right onto the, um, a greater tubercle. Then from there, you’ve got your triceps part of the small test of senior channel, and then also going all the way down to flexor carpi on narrow switch. We talk a lot about the flexor carpi on there. Motor point is a magical, yeah, I’m going to use the word magical because it is empirical point that will soften the, um, a distal attachment, uh, levator scapula 99% of the time when you do actually get that flexor carpi on there’s motor point, right? It will soften that attachment side pretty dramatically. And this is something that we’ve been teaching in the program for probably about 10 years or so. It’s a really nice disappoint to use with levator scapula, shortening and pain at that proximal attachment. Brian, you wanna say anything else before we go on?

Oh, no, that’s good.

They were actually kind of moving right into, uh, exercises now. So the next slide, please.


Last month, these were some exercises or exercise, different levels of the, um, figure four crossover. That’s working quite a bit on the piriformis, this exercise. And a lot of the exercises that we use are based on [inaudible] work. Um, what we’ve done is we’ve actually looked at the different angles as far as the functional anatomy, the sinew channels, and we’ve modified his work, which actually happens quite a bit with people’s methods and techniques is that other people have good ideas about it. And then just kind of form it in a slightly different way. But we did want to give a shout out to Peter Garcia for his miraculous work and an exercise prescription, what he’s done over the years. Um, so again with this, this is what we’ve done for the elevated ilium one exercise, and that’s going to be discussed a lot further in last month’s podcast. And also we have a blog about it as well in the sports medicine, acupuncture.com website. Let’s go to the next side. We’ll talk about exercises where we can use for a levator scapula or a superior shifted the, um, this exercise for, um, elbow press is an exceptional exercise. Brian, do you want to start with that or do you want me to go?

Um, I can start and there’s a little bit of a, um, dialogues of you need to go back and look at it after the recording it’ll give a step-by-step, but the idea is you’re giving a little bit of a press of the elbows into the floor, but more importantly is you’re bringing this, the shoulder blades, the scapula together. So towards the midline in down. So, you know, in this case, levator scapula is going to tend to pull. It might be on one side, but pull that scapula up. So you’re D pressing using lower traps and using, uh, the, the rhomboids and middle traps to bring the shoulder blades together and down. So it’s the same time opening the chest and dropping the shoulder blades.


I don’t know if you got one dad, anything else about it, Matt?

Yeah, I was just looking at the image and how hands and Ian is enjoying it, and it’d be what the scapula is doing. And then 10% of it is going to actually be pressing into the floor. So this is a strong scapular stabilization exercise that works great after needling, um, or doing acupuncture to the levator scapula, pectoralis, minor, small tests and senior channel, um, a number of different points that we could use with this one. This is a simple exercise and kind of a triple star exercise that you can use even to advanced people, um, because it does require quite a bit of concentration to really get those scapulas to really form down and lock in. Then the next exercise is actually called just a second. Uh,

This is a short format, so we can’t go into too much, but, uh, if you go back at some point, if you want to look at the recording and look at the movements of the scapula, we were talking about levator scapula, but pec minor muscle of the lung sinew channel would be involved in a lot of these too, because it’s the antagonist agonist, antagonist relationship with levator scapula because it’s going to depress the scapula. So if it’s really short, maybe the levator scapula has to fight against it, but it also works with the levator scapula and downward rotation of the, of the scap. So I like this exercise in this case also because of that, um, opening and lengthening of the pec minor and kind of normalizing the tension of that, which is kind of a, not the direct channel we’re looking at, we’re looking at the small intestines in your channel, but how maybe the lungs and new channels coming in and relating to this picture, this exercise would be given after the acupuncture treatment. So maybe we’ve needled the pec minor on that side to make it more, um, accessible for the patient right away, you know, their body’s ready for the exercise kind of prime because we’ve reduced, um, tension in the pec minor and allow, or allowing them to more effortlessly do this exercise. Yeah. Cool.

And Brian, I’m sure we kind of rushed with this. There’s a lot of things that we really didn’t talk about. Like the lower trapezius being an antagonist to the levator scap elevation and depression and the literature, easiest being large attachments in your channel. So a size to be able to see that internal and externally related channels of the lung pectoralis, minor, lower trapezius, large intestine being called into Plex. What does that mean? Well, in our mind, if you would needle the motor points of each one of those, you’re already signaling those two mild fascial Sr channels. So therefore if you compliment that signal with more acupuncture points, adjacent and distal, it has to have an effect on those particular muscles. Cause it’s the signaling system that we use in acupuncture. Brian, you must anything about that? That’s good. All right. Cool. All right. So again, um, this elbow press is a great exercise to use as a preliminary exercise. So what about the next exercise please?

Yeah. Okay. This is one of our favorites. I would say triple star, maybe even quadruple started this. Um, this is an exercise that takes a lot of concentration and how we modified it a bit from how it was originally taught is we are increasing the, uh, or decreasing the thoracic flection. So we’re increasing thoracic extension. Let’s walk through that. So the first position the person’s going to have their knuckles on tide young, usually the middle finger there. They’re going to keep the wrist straight. The elbows are going to be out. As you can see, the knees are going to be at 90 degrees and hips are going to be at 90 degrees. We asked the person to go ahead and bring their elbows together toward the ceiling, keeping their fingers right at Thai Ong. All right. So by them doing that, you’ve got scapular protraction.

Then we ask the patient to begin the movement back down, bringing their elbows back down, leading with the rhomboids, leading with that medial border of the scapula and start to bring them together. All right. So you’ve got protraction and retraction. This exercise is really getting the agonist and the antagonist of those muscle groups working together. Now the emphasis, once the patient is able to do this success, now we actually increase it a little bit. We ask the patient to bring their elbows together when they’re going up to the ceiling, but above their nose. So what I’ll do is I’ll actually put my finger right above their nose and try to have the patient, bring their elbows up toward the nose, which is very, very difficult in order to do that. You really need quite a bit of thoracic extension, which is a wonderful thing to do when somebody has thoracic flection in those upper vertebrae, right?

For example, in upper cross syndrome and that head is forward. So this is a great exercise for that. It’s gonna, it’s gonna work the levator scapula quite a bit, a lot of the scapular stabilizers. And it’s, it’s definitely one of our favorites to use. This is also something that you may want to use with somebody who has upper jaw problems, for example, asthma or any kind of, of, uh, lung problems after COVID maybe C O P D, because how it’s working the front, move in the back shoe points and getting those muscles to be able to work in coordination. It’s going to work the channels as well and coordinate the channels.

Yeah. We had a question, uh, regarding this one, if somebody had a difficult timeline on the floor, so we cover stuff like this, a lot in the program where we have a multiple amounts of different exercises that can be done. That would be maybe a simpler exercise. If it’s somebody who has a difficult time of getting on the floor, cause maybe they’re not very conditioned. So I might go with a more simplistic exercise, but there is an actual variation of this, this, this exercise that that’s a little different, but it’s the same concept that can be done seated with a strap. It’s a little bit more isometric where you’re pushing out against the strap and lifting and doing some similar, similar, uh, focus. Um, but that would be, uh, adequate for somebody also, if, if that was, uh, you know, they were ready for that exercise, they could do the seated. Maybe they can’t get on the floor cause they have a shoulder injury and they, they can’t support himself. So you can definitely adapt this one to a seated position or you could just give them a more simple exercise.

Yeah. Cool. Good one. All right. So then what we talked about last time was using acupuncture as assessment, but also, um, using intradermal needles for increasing range of motion or decreasing the amount of pain during an exercise. For example, if somebody is having a hard time appropriate deceptively, trying to figure out how to do this exercise, or they may be limited in their range of motion, kind of stuck, or perhaps they’re feeling a little bit, um, slight pain or minimal pain with it, but it’s inhibiting them from doing the exercise. This is where intradermal needles on actual ordinary vessel points, but also you can use channel points to actual ordinary vessel points works pretty, pretty darn amazing. This is something that we teach in this program. And for those of you that have the sports medicine acupuncture textbook, let me think it’s in chapter four toward the end with, uh, exercise before treatment and exercise after treatment using intradermal needles. So it’s in that section chapter four. So what you’re about to see is a video of the smack program and the postural assessment and practice exercise. And there is a student there that’s having difficulty with actually doing this exercise. And so we’re applying intradermal needles based on what motion was the most painful or difficult. Okay. So let’s look at the next slide, the movie.

Now we know

That you can’t hear, let’s just read

[inaudible]. That is so awesome.


I still love her expressions so far. Um, yeah, so we can probably advance it to the next slide. We use a pine X needles from Sarah and, and you can get those from Lhasa OMS. Um, the point to a millimeters by 1.2 millimeter, um, that’s some of the best ones because it’s large enough to be able to create a sensation, but not large enough to be uncomfortable during movement. So those seem to be worked out pretty well with us. Yeah.

Uh, you can send them home with, uh, I mean, to keep them in for the patient for a few days to, while they’re performing the exercises to assist, you know, to keep that stimulation going. Yeah. Cool. Well, great. I think that’s,

Well, I mean, we could talk about this for hours, but no, I have, it’s regarded gone six minutes over that. So, um, thanks very much you guys, and I think we’re going to be scheduled again in February or March. Hopefully we’ll see you again then. Yeah.

And the next week, uh, Sam Collins is on, I’ll say I was going to be there. Awesome. Yeah,

I talk he’s, he’s hilarious. He’s really quite a sharp as a tack and he’s, he’s fun to listen to. So thank you very much. The American acupuncture council, Brian. You’re awesome as always. And thanks you guys. And hopefully we’ll be connecting again soon.

All right. Great. Thanks everyone. Goodbye.

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Nanopuncture with Clayton Shiu & Poney Chiang


Hi, my name is Poney Chiang from Toronto Canada. I met my opinion education provider from new everyday.net. Welcome to today’s live Facebook broadcast for American Acupuncture Council. My guest today is Dr. Clayton Shiu from New York City…

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Disclaimer: The following is an actual transcript. We do our best to make sure the transcript is as accurate as possible, however, it may contain spelling or grammatical errors.  Due to the unique language of acupuncture, there will be errors, so we suggest you watch the video while reading the transcript.

…Creighton and a bachelor of science in human physiology from Boston university and a master of science with traditional Oriental medicine from psychology, went into medicine. He received his PhD in acupuncture, and moxibustion from the Tangi university of treaters, Chinese medicine, and completed as well as residency at the first teaching hospital of Tangie. Any of you that are joining us today. My note that this is the hospital in which the movie 9,000 year old takes place, and the Clayton were close to you with their father and modern acupuncture. His name is Dr. [inaudible], who is the inventor of a neuro rehabilitation medical. She now KHL, um, Dr. Hsu is the creator of the narrow punches stroke and neuro logical religious rehabilitation system that he teaches across the country. Dr. Sushi. I mean the, uh, the father of modern acupuncture, invited Clayton to present his breakthrough research and then a punctured system at the 2020 international acupuncture conference in change in China, Clayton holds faculty positions at the American Academy of Chinese culture, health sciences in Oakland, and at the American college of nutrition and Chinese medicine, teaching short rehabilitation courses for their doctoral program. Thank you for joining us today. Clayton, how are you doing?

I wanted that. I’m sorry. I blanked out a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. Um, okay. Uh, would you mind telling us about your experience doing a PhD in tangy or what was that like?

Oh, okay. Um, so my time in tangent was about three and a half years approximately. Um, it was a great experience. Um, it was, it’s a hospital facility that’s quite large. Uh, they treated about 10,000 stroke patients a day, um, as a whole. So we were able to really see all kinds of different kinds of cases. Um, everything from like, like full paralysis of the patient to seeing like a nasal tube being put into, um, the patient to help them feed and also seeing how acupuncture can even take a nasal tube out eventually and give the person the ability to swallow and chew food again. Um, so because of all the different wards and different buildings, um, you could find almost any kind of case, um, and kind of track how acupuncture over the long-term can actually treat and help the patient. And I think that was a major advantage of being in that environment, whereas quite often in our own private practices in the States, um, possibly even Canada too, like, you know, maybe we might see a patient for one week or two months at the most.

Um, and it’s not treating like these kinds of severe kind of cases, but in this case, at the tangent first teaching hospital, we can track patients over six months, eight months a year, et cetera. So it’s, it’s, it gives you a wider, bigger perspective on, on an arc of how a person can heal versus, you know, when we have a private practice, we think, Oh man, okay, maybe in six sessions, something should happen or not. And so my, my perspective on time and also, uh, frequency for treating, uh, certain neurological disorders changed a lot after being there. So

Yeah, it must have been great to be able to see it sort of firsthand the CMB applied every day. Um, I would imagine PA patients are admitted to the hospital and begin acupuncture immediately, right? There’s no waiting for six weeks before they’re discharged from our Western hospital before they come to our private practice. Right. And they’re doing acupuncture every day, maybe several times a day.

Yeah. They, um, at a hospital like this for probably getting treated like at least two sessions of acupuncture, two more sessions of physical therapy, moxa, um, you know, Twain off like, uh, herbal medicines, you know? So, so in a sense you’re getting treated like six to nine times a day, or you’re very active. You’re not very complacent basically. And I like the rooms are, uh, in certain words they’re very big. So like, you know, Chinese are very family oriented, so there’s there’s room for your whole family to kind of sit there, you know, and be loved. So it was very nice to see that too. Um, but yeah, and it was, it was great to see like different, um, like the different directors and specialists in each ward, they were good at different things. So you could, you could pick their brain and ask them, like, how would they needle something? Or why is, why are you using, you know, spleen six this way versus that way, you know, et cetera. Cause that’s a lot of the devil’s in the details, you know? So, um, you puncture, so yeah.

Was like amazing. I’m jealous. Okay. Um, so, um, tell us about your style called nano puncture. What if it’s possible in a few words or a few sentences to give us a nutshell one nano?

Sure. Um, so after I returned to the States, uh, um, I want to give the system of what I was doing. Um, like a kind of a different name. One is it’s a play on words because nano is like the smallest measurable unit in most cases. So it was a play on words of Tai Chi, right? Because Tigie could refer to the smallest or the largest, um, kind of measurement. So nano is referring to like that we’re simply using like needles and the acupuncture, but we can have a large effect to treat like paralysis or treats speech issues or treat, you know, pretty miraculous things. Whenever you see like acupuncture do a very spontaneous kind of changes someone that’s still fascinates me today. Um, and then the other word origin of nano puncture was I was, I was treating a very famous, uh, prostate surgeon and he didn’t believe in acupuncture at first.

And so when I treated him, he could feel me manipulate the needle and I basically converted him. And so, because he was doing sensories, right. He wouldn’t, he wouldn’t need to like the best deference, which was a very small right on a tissue. So he was the first surgeon that kind of related to what needles can do because this needles are a little bit smaller than ours, you know? And we were saying that, Oh, the instrument’s so small. It’s like, it’s like, nano-sized right. So, so that’s how we came up with the word nano puncture. So, so in a sense, nano is like the smallest, smallest unit. Right. Which is like the acupuncture versus reviewing like a major machine or a major, you know, device like a gamma, like a gamma Ray or something like that. So, you know, we’re using just the needles, we’re able to get like an amazing result. So yeah. So that’s that for that. Um, and then mix them with a training from can Jen has just 20 years of like sports medicine and orthopedic experience and stuff like that. So, so we gave it that label. Yeah.

Actually I’m glad you brought up like gamma knife and things like that. Because as part of the material that you teach you to teach something called photo biomodulation and I take it, that sounds a lot like star Trek to me, which sounds really exciting. I’m nothing wrong against dark trade. I’m a trache. So tell me about what that is. Sounds like full-time for Peters.


Right. The photo biomodulation or, um, uh, could you repeat your question one time? Cause the, uh, the signal got a little slow.

Tell us what photobiomodulation is that, are you teaching your training program?

Sure. So, uh, what we like to do is even though we’re using, um, or using acupuncture and traditional needle manipulation methods, I like to combine modern technology with what I do. Um, it’s kind of the yin and yang to the practice. Uh, I do like photo biomodulation a lot because what, what sunlight is the chlorophyll red light is to the mitochondria of your cells. And so it’ll actually reset the P and bring energy and create energy into the cells of your body. So interestingly enough, for, for, for us as humans or animals, or, uh, or what have you like, we, we have tissue, right. And if you take this flash like off my cell phone, right. So this is every color in the spectrum, but if I put my finger over it, okay. Like this, right. You see a red light. Okay. And the reason why is that wavelength is about 610, uh, nanometer wavelength.

And that is the wavelength of the red wavelength color. And the red wavelength color is the color of light that can penetrate through our flesh into our muscles, which is what photo biomodulation uses. So that red light okay. Passes through human flesh into the tissue, into the cells. And so with photobiomodulation you can now pulse the frequency to adjust to things like gamma, brainwaves, or Delta brainwaves. You can, you can actually, um, increase the wavelength up to 700, 800 or near infrared light. Um, and when you do that, the neuron for infrared light spectrum will actually kill the viruses, including COVID. That’s why a lot of our devices today have like, you know, the cell phone, cleaner box or the air cleaner with the UV light, you know, and that’s, and that’s not a new thing. Anyone that has surgery before they do any surgery or down to work, they always flash a UV light device to actually prepare the room.


Um, so that’s, so what we do is we use photobiomodulation, we will put it in a tissue that’s maybe we knew we activated the nerves of that body, but we know the tissue isn’t is still weak and fatigued, so we can use red light that way. Um, there’s also devices that go into the nose, right. Or into the tongue area. And what happens is because of the cranial nerves, like cranium, or, um, like the old factory created owner and the nerves attached to the hypoglossal, you can simulate that rather than help, but speech and also with memory. So for like all commerce patients, there’s a great device called the V light, which there’ll be like a headset and like a little stimulator that stimulates gamma, um, for the speech, right. Gamma, wavelength, and then a nose clip. And the clip will shine into that, that area of the factoring of that has like thousands of little Villa.

Okay. And when I’ve, when I worked for end, that it’s actually helped patients, who’ve had like, uh, dementia and memory fog where actually seen noticeable improvements, you know, and that’s a great device it’s shining off, you know, a red light wavelength, um, up through the nose. So, so the great thing about, yeah, and it works great with acupuncture. So like, whereas acupuncture can move CHAM, blood, right. Things like red light and OXA charges, the blood gives it energy. Do you see what I mean? So one thing creates like the flow, the other thing creates, like in a sense, um, like March she, for that blood or for that tissue. So

Do you have a preference of doing, uh photobiomodulation first and then acupuncture or vice versa? Do you do them at the same session or the patients come in separate sessions for different modalities?

Oh, no. I always do acupuncture and like a full neurological assessment first, and then we decide if they need, um, photobiomodulation um, and the, you know, the thing is, is even though it’s great for like, if you have lower back pain, if what I can tell you is that if you have more of a pinpoint lower back pain, or if, you know, it’s affecting the disc, I would use acupuncture first and then do the photo biomodulation to follow up, uh, because acupuncture is still extremely precise. Um, and then once you get that flow, it’s good to have that. So we have like, would you have a light bag? We have the region pod at my office. Um, so we, what we did was created like a rejuvenation studio. So we may have, like, we may have taken acupuncture to a certain extent. And then we feel like, okay, we know everything is rewired and plugged in together, but you know, the power sources and high enough still send them a sample. Yeah. Like let’s, let’s use, use the red light or let’s use like give the person energy, you know? So then we may say, try to do like 10 sessions of red light and then come back. We’re gonna reevaluate. Um, yeah. And, and the interesting thing is, uh, photobiomodulation will actually work on the digestive system. It’s not just for muscles and tendons. Um, we’ve had people had, um, digestive issues and swelling or water retention and a lot of dampness and the red light actually works. Photobiomodulation works great for that. So

Cool. And I like your analogy. Um, you have to make sure things are connected properly first, before you try to turn off the power, right. There’s no point trying to power. It is not connected. So to that, presumably through acupuncture, we’re reducing the resistance of the, um, of the nervous system. So now we have greater flow, right. That’s resistance or more or more conductivity. Now, once that groundwork is done, now it’s ready to actually get some sort of tonification from the F for the red light. Then did I read, I can actually go somewhere and do do the things that it’s intended to do to help you understand. Thank you very much for that. Um, can you tell us, you know, um, how, how can acupunctures, um, benefit from learning from you or learning from, um, nano puncture?

Um, well, I think what I do is we do give like neuro anatomy lessons and education on what a stroke concussion or traumatic brain injury is. But what we do is I set them a [inaudible] program that I did from 10 and two different modules. So, um, what we’d like to do is bring back a lot of the classical knee manipulation, um, so that, you know, you can, you can manipulate something with your needle and also get like the different, like, effects that I learned through [inaudible] or, you know, if we need like heart one, we, you can feel, and you can even direct it into each finger, like the sensation of, of the nerve and stuff like that. So we train you on how to do that. Um, so we might take a section of the body, like the arm or the leg, and for one weekend for about 16 hours or, you know, more you’re constantly practicing and needling mix them with, um, I’ll invite, like just, I’ve never met and I’ll demonstrate how I would approach them in front of the crowd, so of acupuncturists.

So we, we treat them together, but I like to, I think there’s a lot of little details, um, even just, even just down to positioning. Right. And I know like your work is amazing with, within the Academy and dissection and stuff, and, you know, if you don’t position the body correctly, we can’t needle. Right. We can’t get into that sweet spot to manipulate the Meridian and the nerves and the tissue. So it’s, uh, I think that takes like, almost like, uh, like committed, coordinated group practice. It’s like, it’s like when you join a, like a tiger group and everyone’s trying to do form at the same time, you know, and right. One bird was done in one minute, the other people are done in 10 minutes and you, you tend to reverberate together. And so you can feel, you know, the training and what you have to do to the concussion part of it. And then there’s the hands-on part that I think makes our modules special. Yeah.

Can you share with us like a very memorable patient or a case where you, you know, um, feel that you couldn’t have helped them as well as you could, or her as well as you could have had, you know, incorporated let’s put about modulation or Chanel K char or something, some of the things that you’ve learned in China, or some of the things that you discover yourself, you know, private practice,

You mean, like was difficult. And then when we tried that technique and it made it work or something like that, like yeah.

Something inspiring for us. I never get tired of listening to those success stories.

Right, right. Um, yeah, I think, I think, uh, so there, there is quite a few patients, um, that, like, one of my things I left to do is, uh, speech and speech paralysis and dysphasia. And we, you know, we had a patient who, uh, had a very severe stroke about three years ago. And, um, he was, you know, he had salivation problems. It has salivation problems, he’s in a wheelchair. And, um, it’s a difficult case for anybody to treat basically. But at the same time, like just kept putting in different points, like non [inaudible] and angled correctly, like GB, Toni, and long glues, like [inaudible] and stuff now. And when it came close to, uh, to the election time, right. And this patient is usually he always like this, he’s kind of like his eyes are closed, you know, he’s very quiet. Right. And we would treat them twice a day. Like he stays at my office all day and we treat them twice with about a three hour window in between. But about like four weeks ago, when it came close to election time, you know, we asked them who, who we should vote, or, you know, he’s lying there and just goes by them like that, you know, like that,

Yeah. It was like the first word he spoken in our office that was like, you know, cause, uh, you know, it wasn’t a yes or no question. It was something you had to think about. And then later it kept going and we asked him, well, who should run for president? And he said, Dr. Shoe. Right. So we were like, like he could cognitively had a sense of humor. Right. Like he could put that together. So after that, and my staff were like, we just have mocks on the neck. We kept doing all this stuff in the brainstem. And, um, yeah. So it was, uh, it was pretty cool. So it was, you know,

Maybe, maybe you can sit in a nomination for you to become the surgeon general [inaudible] yeah.


Would you be able, um, to give us some tips or advisors, some simple technique or insight, uh, from your unconscious system so that maybe we can start applying a little bit. I know it’s not something that we can really learn over a webinar, but if, is there anything you can, any of tips and advice at the thing I, myself and our viewers would be very appreciated.

Yeah. I think, um, no matter which system you’re using, um, one of the things like Dr. Sherwin says is, uh, he was famous for, for using the principle or creating the principle of quantitative manipulation. Right. So, and what that means is is every 10 minutes we would do a technique like Sparrow pecking, or Phoenix flapping their wings on plants like neg Juan or Sonia and chow because he knew, and he could tell that like every 10 minutes you have to re stimulate the nerves. So my advice is like, it doesn’t matter if you’re using [inaudible] or not whatever technique it is. Like I would go back, we’ll just leave your patient there for like 30 minutes or 40 minutes or whatever, like every 10 minutes go back and just touch that needle. Uh, give it a little adjustment, no matter what your technique is, you know?

And then you’re going to see like a more drastic change in results because, because maybe the body responded that it plateaus and during the session, you can peak it back up. You know? So that’s something that he was very strict about. Like everybody knew that in this hospital, it was very interesting. And I knew that when, uh, one of the hospitals only had 200 beds, he would, like, I heard he would run out of the office, make sure someone manipulated the needle correctly, then run back to his, like, you know, to his conference. He was very strict on that. Yeah. And then also just trying to take care of your hands, whether you’re practicing Tai-Chi or sword work or something, like treat your hands, like they’re gold because, uh, you know, they’re your instruments, right? So you want to make sure you’re always like, you know, don’t, don’t just neglect them and, you know, leave them on a table somewhere, but treat your hand really good and keep them like help because when they’re helping and supple and soft, you can, you can get better results too. You can be more sensitive and it increases your, your tingly, which is like your listening skill, like the needle. So yeah.

To touch detention, the, uh, advisor about, um, sort of re stimulating the needles every 10 minutes or so she didn’t give us an idea, like what they’re doing, kind of w or in your practice that you saw, um, like how long was the average, uh, stroke. We have acupuncture session. And then within that timeframe, how many times are they going into re-stimulate?

Yeah, so, uh, I would say like the, the average time takes about probably about 45 minutes to like an hour for a stroke patient, because you’re going to treat the front for about 20 minutes and then the back for 20 minutes or a specific part of the body. Right. And then you should be like every 10, 15 minutes, you should be going back to manipulate the session. We usually say that like, one course of treatment would be 30 sessions at that hospital. Right. But a lot of patients in the word I was in, um, it was like an international word. So like patients who were living in that hospital for, for like several months, like they, they were getting in a special program, you know? Um, so, you know, in terms of like, it was very congruent to what we say about neuroplasticity. If you think about like, you know, we, usually we say, right, but if, if something’s pretty severely damaged, like if there is damage to the brain STEM or to some of the upper motor tracks, you know, you’re looking at 20 or 30 sessions.

And I think the important thing why I’m glad you’re a teacher and, and other of our peers are teaching, this is because, you know, this isn’t like spraining an ankle new, you need to explain to the patient a care plan and figure out, um, how long, and realistically it would take for them to recover this. That’s not going to be done in five sessions and five quick sessions, like, you know, um, so it’s important that you can guide and manage the patient on the law through that process. So, yeah, I mean, one of the inspirational stories is, uh, I want to add to that is like, for instance, uh, there’s a patient, um, and his name is Jim Wharton and he was the, he was the creator of active, isolated stretching. He’s he coached many Olympic athletes and runners. Right. And he had a stroke, uh, uh, about a year ago.

And he came into my office about a month after the stroke. And he was, he completely could not move. Um, you know, he had a gastric tube and everything he couldn’t speak. And I can tell you that one year later. Okay. Because it was a very severe stroke. Uh, well, within six months he was already eating without a gastric tube and he’s a healthy guy to amazing specimen person. But one year later he was riding the train, the subway train, and he gave me a stretching session. So he treated me instead of I treated him. Right. And it was amazing. Yes. But realistically,

Yeah, yeah. A year is nothing compared to having to get your life back. Right. I mean, it’s all, it’s all relative. Um, right. Thank you very much for sharing your experience with us about an Ana puncture before, if our listeners and viewers find out more information, do you have a website or some social media information? You can let us know so we can get in touch with you or get more information about your upcoming training sessions.

Sure. Um, it’s an amateur seminar doc. Um, and my clinic website is, is, uh, the shoe clinic.com too. So, uh, we’re gonna, we’re going to create some, um, new, online format so people can start learning the different modules. I’m teaching again. Um, cause of Irvin can’t really, um, easily meet face to face, but we’re going to create, we’re going to do the academic portions. And then later we’re going to have like group, uh, when everything is more in control, we’ll have like a group practical time too. So, but yeah, we plan to put a lot of the modules. And so it’ll be like upper extremity, lower extremity, speech paralysis, uh, concussion, like, um, but the first one will probably be the base. We call it the, the, the classical, uh, points, or I actually caught them. They’re all flash. So, because I believe the Chenelle

Cocho points, everyone should know and know how to manipulate so that at least you have something in your toolbox, but yeah. So we’re going to have that coming up in 2021. So yeah, very excited. Thank you very much, Clayton. It’s been awesome talking to you and for our listeners, don’t forget to join us next week. We’re going to have another exciting show with my cohost, Virginia Doran. Thank you. And take care.

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Yuan Qi Acupuncture – Poney Chiang & Suzanne Robidoux


Hi, good afternoon. My name is Poney Chiang. I’m one of your hosts for American Acupuncture’s live Facebook podcast show today. My special guest is Suzanne Robidoux, who is joining us all the way from Nanjing China. Dr. Susan Robidoux has spent over 20 years in China sharing when, after completing her master’s degree in us and, uh, went to China to learn Chinese language and martial arts, but ended up there until today.

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Disclaimer: The following is an actual transcript. We do our best to make sure the transcript is as accurate as possible, however, it may contain spelling or grammatical errors.  Due to the unique language of acupuncture, there will be errors, so we suggest you watch the video while reading the transcript.

And, uh, she was holding a five different distinct lineages of Chinese medicine and martial arts. We should continues to teach and practice. Do you have a PhD in nine gene? She practiced at the neurological hospital treating diseases such as major depressive disorders and post-stroke paralysis after completing her PhD. She spent the following year. So the classical medical systems from various Chinese medical masters to learn their techniques. She combines classical acupuncture, classical moxibustion gene Fong, which is the type of classical herbal system with diet, lifestyle and internal arts and teaching. She’s also the author of three different textbooks on acupuncture, Costco, hers, and Bhagwan thank you for joining us today, Suzanne.

Thank you for having me pony.

I would like to, uh, think you have brains today about, uh, a form of, uh, acupuncture to call it UN she acupuncture that I’d been hearing here in ravey views on, um, could you tell us a little about, about it? What is it, um, how is different from our standard TCM type of acupuncture?

Hmm. Yeah, it’d be my pleasure. Um, UNC acupuncture is a, it’s a classical type of acupuncture. Uh it’s based on the teachings of [inaudible] and the teachings of [inaudible] and from these teachings and from the information of [inaudible] and send you a gig, uh, masters simply, um, and other masters in Taiwan build a system, uh, based on using the cheesy that we have the essence T that we have in our dantian and use that she, in order to balance, um, the channels in our bodies in order to remove obstacles, to increase the flow, uh, but also to increase the general, uh, health care of our body. Um, the main goal of, of the system is using 60 points, 60 very specific points. Uh, we have a very specific needling technique as well, that, um, is used on all the points and using this technique, using these very specific points, we’re able to use the essence T to balance the body now by balancing the body, we increase healthcare. Uh, we improve vision improved memory, but most importantly, of course, it’s, it’s mainly used for quick pain relief. So pain relief relief on numbness, um, blockages, and sometimes I’ve used it also for, um, lack of motility of, of limbs, like a trip for trigger finger or frozen shoulder.

Interesting. Um, are there specific type of patient demographic that would best benefit from this or, or certain types of conditions you in your mind you go, Oh, this is something that you mentioned is absolutely going to be a great for or is broadly approvable.

Yes. The, the, the best patients for this technique is patients that are suffering from chronic pain. Uh, it’s good for many things. We also use it for internal organ, um, disorders, but it’s really best to use when people are suffering from chronic pain. Uh, the best is with when people are suffering from chronic pain, that is result of either a surgery or trauma, then you do think the dantian, she will be a lot more effective, a lot quicker. And within one to three treatments, we can get a great hold on that level of pain.

Okay. Um, so I’m understanding that the system has 60 different points and I’m imagining that it’s a complete different than your quote unquote standard acupuncture points, or are they, they overlaps, okay. They’re different. Okay.

Points that overlap, uh, in terms of location. But interestingly enough is that these points are on different channels. Then what the, the classical points that we learn in TCM. So, um, they are completely different than, than our TCM points location.

Yeah. So they’re not, it’s not, uh, you have the 12 Meridian base. These are extra, like extra, extra ordinary points. They’re outside the channel system.

No, actually they are on the channel. So the, our, our system is based, uh, the, it combines the channel theory combines, um, the tendon or muscular system. And, um, the points are on the channels on the same line, but different, um, locations.

Okay. And, um, um, would you be able to share with us like a clinical story or something that’s memorable, maybe perhaps with something that wowed you when you’re first learning this, how did you first hear about this? Something that will help us, uh, appreciate from your personal experience? Um, that was really, really memorable for you?

Um, sure. Um, I think we all learn acupuncture because we like helping people and release their suffering. And, um, what’s great about the system is we’re able to, uh, get a feedback from our patient. And that’s part of the treatment protocol with the system. You, you put one needle and then you wait for the feedback of the patient and that’s what guides you actually to, uh, know how to continue the treatment protocol. And so, um, I can share maybe one, one of the, uh, first case when I first started teaching the system, I was in Denmark and, uh, one of the participants, one of the acupuncturist was there and she volunteered, uh, to receive a treatment. And she had actually gone to learn acupuncture because of her chronic pain and what had happened to her. She went hiking when she was in her teens and her friend.

Uh, she was a very small lady and her friend had fallen on her and her and her backpack crushed her upper back. And since that moment, she had been suffering from a chronic, upper back pain and tension. It, it affected everything. It affected migraines, dizziness, uh, it caused her posture to be, uh, very stiff and abnormal. And through all the treatments she got through all acupuncture school, nothing released this pain. And by, by needling her according to UN she and needling the corresponding channels that were blocked, um, we were, I was able to needle her arm and follow the pain through, and the pain really left, uh, chronologically backwards, according to how the pain evolved in her body. And after five needles on her, um, arm on her lower arm, uh, her pain was completely gone. And so I saw her the day, the next day, and two days later, and her pain was still gone. Um, and when I came back to Denmark to teach the next year, the pain was still gone. So it is always a pleasure to be able to, to practice you. And she, um, patients that are suffering so much for so many years and just release their pain just by their, their energies, balancing the channels, and also engaging that, that lower dantian that we have.

That’s a great story.

It’s a great pleasure.

Um, so I’m hearing that you’re needling, uh, uh, on the arm is UN Xi acupuncture a form of, uh, more of a distal style acupuncture. The, these points are, uh, in the extremities.

That’s right. So the 60 points are on the extremities. However, what we’re using is that she in a low, lower dantian, and so we’re by using this, the Sochi, so a need, um, points below the elbows and the knees, um, is activating the chin, the lower dantian. And if it isn’t, then we have another technique in the lower dantian to, to fortify and activate.

Hmm. Sounds like it’s kind of a very, um, uh, uh, uh, deep rooted system that draws on like the venture level to, to, uh, to enable healing, I guess usually when we need a, would probably just, um, maybe working on the year in a way, not as deep as, uh, as, uh, as the name of the system implies. Um, I think it’s great that it’s a, uh, distal based system. There are obviously certain limitations or some, um, certain patients, um, you know, may or may not be, um, may have access to the torso, right. Uh, bedridden patients or wheelchair patients, you know, and also even like people that practice more and maybe perhaps communities that acupuncture where, um, you know, uh, they are more of a seated. And so, um, access to below the elbows and knees are more practical. So I think this might, might be, uh, um, very palatable to a lot of practitioners out there that, um, that this is consistent with their style of practice. Um, I know this is a very complicated system, uh, when us coming, but it’s a sophisticated system. And, um, um, but do you think it’s possible, there’s some sort of simple things that you might be able to share with us? Uh, like maybe a simple diagnostic or simple palpation, single needling thing, if it’s possible, if it’s not let me know, um, just to maybe let our viewers, uh, experiment with it themselves or try on a patient that’s, they’re having some clinical challenges with, is that something that’s possible to share?

Well, okay. So first I agree completely with you. It’s a system, first of all, that’s very easy to use if you’re using a community acupuncture or if you’re treating, um, paralyzed patients, you’re, you have access to the Bo the limbs of the body, a lot easier than the trunk or the back of the, so it’s very easy to use, and it’s fairly easy to learn since it only takes a few hours, you know, the 60 points. Um, and, and then you’re able to, to practice, once you learn the location, you’re able to practice the depth of the points, um, what I would be able to share. Um, it’s, it’s not that I don’t want to share is just that it’s, it’s really a complete system within itself. And, um, after learning the location, you have to learn the needling technique. And then, then the treatment protocol, which is very important that if you don’t follow the steps, then you might, um, cause further blockage within the patient’s body.

And so, um, what I could learn, what I could speak about is maybe the palpation technique, um, within the system we, for, for the earth points, uh, as we use a lot of the five element points, um, the earth points are always in between, um, the wrists and elbows. And so, and there are a long, uh, the channels. However, the locations of the channel in the classical texts, uh, are really, really close to the bone. And so this needling approach will be a lot about palpating along the area of the bone and developing that sensation or that sensitivity that, that we can develop as acupuncturist, not on the chin level, but also at a, as a channel level and really feel the condition of the channel. And once we can feel the channel on the side of the bone, then we’re able to really power pate where the blockage is. And once that happens, then we know exactly the location of the point. One of the things that my, my teacher always says is if, if we’re not feeling the entrance of the needle before we need, or we can’t needle the point. So basically it, what he meant by that is he, we really need to feel the entrance, uh, within the channel. So the, the fine, um, entry point before we actually use our needles.

Okay. Um, can you talk about, um, like, just give us an example of one point and then describe how describe the technique that would be used for that point. Are there different techniques for different points or, um, or is it a similar technique applied to the 60 points?

Um, the needling technique that we applied to the points is very similar. Um, we must reach the needle tip within the channel, feel the channel cheat, and then, uh, we lift the needle very slightly, give it space. And after that, we turn counter clockwise and counterclockwise, we’ll the flow of the cheek balancing the body, um, in terms of points. Sure. Um, what, what I thought of when you asked that question, as I thought about my brother-in-law, uh, that was suffering from very chronic elbow pain. So the, uh, entrance, so the heart channel, um, at the elbow was, was hurting him so severely that nobody could even palpated. It woke him up at night. It was very severe. And this occurred after a very severe disappointment and separation in his relationship. And, uh, he tried everything to get rid of it, but nothing was, was useful.

And so if we look, um, at this channel for us, the elbow, uh, the map that I have behind me separates the body in the five elements. So our whole body is not only separated in channels. It’s also separated in, in elements. And so as, uh, the elbow is the element of water I needed to reach, uh, on the corresponding channel. Uh, so the heart channel being shalion, uh, the corresponding channel being, um, shall young. So I needed the water point of shall yang on, um, on the opposite side. Uh, and as soon as I needled this pain, he felt a shooting pain down his arm, and I just stimulated the needle. So, um, it’s very close to gallbladder 34 area, but it, it isn’t. So once we learned the location of the points, uh, you’ll know exactly where they are. And as soon as the pain was gone, then that blockage had left through, uh, the heart channel. And, uh, the pain was completely gone. Now, this was about five years ago and the pain hasn’t returned since

Hmm. That’s really useful. Um, and then it’s a great success story. And also for me, I think, I think for the other viewers too, uh, gives us a sense of how you, um, are attempting to balance the energy and the thought process does involve, uh, so that that’s, uh, I think, uh, uh, thirsty people are starting to have a better understanding of, um, the, um, the, the, the process, um, of, uh, of the strategies that acupuncture. Can you tell us, um, how will learning, does wrenches of acupuncture compliment, uh, TCM staff acupuncture, or compliment people that do more to be used to stash score, stab acupuncture would do, is it something that they can super impose? Something they, uh, um, I don’t know, like, uh, sequences, uh, how do you have any thoughts on that?

Yes. Um, this, again, she acupuncture is used, it takes about 10 to 15 minutes, uh, in terms of using these points, we only use about one to five of these points, and afterwards, of course, we can integrate any kind of TCM acupuncture treatment that we would normally do with our patients. And so this, this treatment, we usually do it in the beginning to release that, that acute type of pain or the acute excessive blockage in the body. And afterward, it just makes the TCM treatment more successful or more acceptable and peaceful for the patient. Or we could use it at the end of our treatment when, when we’ve completed our treatment, but there’s still a nagging pain somewhere in the back or, uh, in, in the neck. And then we can use one or two points release that pressure release that blockage, and then the patient goes home without any nagging pain or residual pain. So this system is very well combined with any other acupuncture techniques that, that somebody might do. I always use it with TCM points. I use it with, um, scalp acupuncture and, and even with moxa, it integrates very well. It’s a, it’s a very successful tool to have as an acupuncturist.

Yeah. Sounds, sounds like it’s very versatile. Uh, um, obviously the fact that it’s, uh, in the extremities, um, it wouldn’t, it wouldn’t interfere with, uh, you know, Microsystems on the scalp or on a year and things like that. Um, thank you very much for giving us a little bit of a introduction. Are you, and shacupuncture puncher today. Um, if we want to learn more about your end sheet, are there some resources that you can recommend, Suzanne?

Um, yes. So unfortunately there isn’t any English publication right now, but we do teach the course online regularly. Um, it’s a one weekend course, uh, uh, accredited by, um, NCC, wham. I used to teach it all over the world, but now with COVID, uh, it’s, it’s better taught online that easier for everyone. And of course, there’s these maps that you can get with the locations we spent over a year, really working hard on getting all the specifics, um, for the point location to help people really, um, cause without the point of location, then no one would get results with this system. So these maps are very useful to have in clinic. Um, and then once you, you know, the points and you’ve taken the course, it’s all about practice.

Yes. Can you give us the, uh, the, the web, the name of your website or the name of, um, some online? Um, yes. Yeah,

Yeah. Um, so my website is a Chinesemedicinetraveller.com, a traveler with two L’s and.com. And you can find everything, uh, about the courses online, about the courses in various location that we have done in the past. And of course the charts are available for you. Great. Thank you very much for spending your time with us. And, uh, we definitely look forward to learning more about your entry criteria in the future. It was very nice seeing you again, Poney and thank you for this, uh, this chat. It was very fun. And, uh, looking forward to see you again,

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